First AppleScript deprecation warning

Posted on
Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:44 am
RogueProeliator offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

Let's give Matt and Jay some credit... whatever your thoughts on their specific choices in support / features / technology -- they have been running a (presumably) successful software product for something like 1000 years (rough estimate), so I think they make good and careful decisions.

And Terry, I don't believe for one moment that you only have "several" RPi's around -- with your history I imagine you built a 2000-node RPi cluster in your garage next to the large "suck all the electricity from the street" computer system. :)

Posted on
Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:13 am
Different Computers offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

My choice for a second server platform would be the AppleTV.

Yes, I know that's apple Pie in the sky thinking.

SmartThings refugee, so happy to be on Indigo. 10.13.6 on an i5 MBP w/Harmony Hub, Hue, DomoPad, Dynamic URL, Device Extensions, HomeKit Bridge, MatplotLib, Plex, uniFAP, Wunderground, Nanoleaf, LED Simple Effects, Airfoil Pro, Grafana.

Posted on
Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:09 am
kw123 offline
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First AppleScript deprecation warning

As for the rpi
A it does not have enough memory to run all the plugins
The sd card would need to be replaced by a ssd connected hard drive to run.
The CPI should be able to handle it I believe.

May be the rpi4 will do it

Or better the new graphics system from NVIDIA ... that would be cool —Matt Jay?


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Posted on
Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:48 am
Brady offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

kw123 wrote:
As for the rpi
A it does not have enough memory to run all the plugins
The sd card would need to be replaced by a ssd connected hard drive to run.
The CPI should be able to handle it I believe.

May be the rpi4 will do it

Or better the new graphics system from NVIDIA ... that would be cool —Matt Jay?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


If HomeSeer can run on an rpi with several plugins, I have no doubt Indigo would fly on a pi. HomeSeer is a bunch of .NET code running via Mono, it is super messy. That said... I agree with others that I'd prefer the ability to run on my own linux server.

Jay/Matt, sorry I opened a can of worms lol. I'm very excited for the future of Indigo.

Posted on
Sun Oct 15, 2017 3:37 am
Umtauscher offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

Well Matt and Jay,

perhaps it would be a good idea to update the Apple Script dokumentation http://wiki.indigodomo.com/doku.php?id=common_ha_tasks and convert those script to python. to let anyone know, how it's done. ;-)
Cheers
Wilhelm

Posted on
Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:01 am
matt (support) offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

Yes, we definitely need to get that documentation (and probably several other spots) updated.

Image

Posted on
Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:21 am
jay (support) offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

Umtauscher wrote:
Oh yeah, let's put it into a virtual machine.


What would make you think we'd put anything into a VM? Shipping a product that requires a VM to run would definitely not be something we'd be very interested in. It's why we don't support Hackintoshes for instance.

RogueProeliator wrote:
Let's give Matt and Jay some credit... whatever your thoughts on their specific choices in support / features / technology -- they have been running a (presumably) successful software product for something like 1000 years (rough estimate), so I think they make good and careful decisions.


We certainly don't make major decisions without spending a lot of time thinking them through. We always want to do what's best for our customers, but we do also have a business to run and that will sometimes require making difficult decisions. The best we can do is remind people that we have families to support so we have to do what's best for the business.

Different Computers wrote:
My choice for a second server platform would be the AppleTV.


Not possible given the restrictions in tvOS/SDK. I seriously doubt Apple will ever allow that kind of background app, particularly when it competes directly with their own product (HomeKit and the tvOS-based server they never want to talk about because "servers" in the home are completely unnecessary! This is a position shared by Google and others as well.).

Brady wrote:
If HomeSeer can run on an rpi with several plugins, I have no doubt Indigo would fly on a pi. HomeSeer is a bunch of .NET code running via Mono, it is super messy.


Indeed... In terms of memory, just a quick look at my Mac shows that I have 15 plugins running along with the Indigo Server and the Indigo Web Server and it's using around 260MB. And that's without much optimization.

Jay (Indigo Support)
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Posted on
Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:39 am
durosity offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

jay (support) wrote:
Brady wrote:
If HomeSeer can run on an rpi with several plugins, I have no doubt Indigo would fly on a pi. HomeSeer is a bunch of .NET code running via Mono, it is super messy.


Indeed... In terms of memory, just a quick look at my Mac shows that I have 15 plugins running along with the Indigo Server and the Indigo Web Server and it's using around 260MB. And that's without much optimization.


Sounds exceptionally light weight. I suggest you change your efforts from a Pi port to an LCII package. And as a side bonus for that it’ll run system 7.1.2.. which supports AppleScript! No need to depreciate it all after all!

Computer says no.

Posted on
Tue Oct 17, 2017 10:36 am
roussell offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

jay (support) wrote:
Umtauscher wrote:
Oh yeah, let's put it into a virtual machine.


What would make you think we'd put anything into a VM? Shipping a product that requires a VM to run would definitely not be something we'd be very interested in. It's why we don't support Hackintoshes for instance..


I think he was referring to more of a set of pre-compiled generic binaries that could be installed on a VM. Although, I'd suspect shipping a prebuilt VM or Docker-style container is a lot more favorable for support than supporting a specific ARM-targeting installation for a specific hobbiest-grade board like the RPi. I know everyone hates the thought of .NET/Java/ (Kotlin, anyone???)/whatever. But it is a nice way to ship compiled binaries that can run on several platforms without the hassle of separate tool chains and build utilities for ARM/x86/etc.

BTW, anyone thinking that just because HS ships a version of their software on the Pi, or you can install it yourself - try it with a handful of chatty plugins. It's shit, and it really doesn't have much to do with the software. My HA system has a lot of external things that it talks to, cameras, other boards, internet, you name it. The RPi shares a bus between the USB and the Ethernet. Wanna use a USB drive to avoid premature SD card (and HA system) death? Cool, just watch your Ethernet performance drop in the toilet as you're writing logs, storing/retrieving video or doing anything drive-intensive. These boards are great for secondary lightweight tasks, or even your primary system If you only have a hand full of Bash/Python/Perl scripts, but do anything intensive, and you'll quickly reach its limits. The Home Assistant, OpenHAB & Homeseer folks have already ran into this.

IF a future version of Indigo can be installed on a Pi, that'll be awesome. If it has to be installed on a Pi, well...

Terry

Posted on
Wed Oct 18, 2017 5:23 am
manders offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

Is there anyway to scan the indigo database to see where I'm using AppleScript... I've used it heavily and I can see that this is going to be a time consuming issue for me. TBH my first step is to see where I'm using AppleScript and make sure I don't miss anything... my next step will be to evaluate that other solutions.

Posted on
Wed Oct 18, 2017 9:51 am
jay (support) offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

manders wrote:
Is there anyway to scan the indigo database to see where I'm using AppleScript... I've used it heavily and I can see that this is going to be a time consuming issue for me. TBH my first step is to see where I'm using AppleScript and make sure I don't miss anything... my next step will be to evaluate that other solutions.


As we've said in other places, we'll provide some way to make AppleScript usage in your database more visible. It may be a separate tool or it may be built in to a 7.1.x maintenance release (we don't know the specifics yet).

If you want to start immediately, it's possible to open your Indigo DB in a text editor (make a copy first). It's an XML file that can be opened in any text editor. It's somewhat cryptic, but you can glean some information from there. Look for ScriptSource and ScriptLink elements - the former will show the script source and the latter will just have garbage data (an alias record pointing to the script file). But in any case you can just look at the elements that enclose those things to see where they are being used.

Note: you don't want to try to edit the db file by hand. While it's possible to do so, it's much more likely that you'll end up with a corrupt database. Open a copy of the db file, and just use it to find the names of the Schedule/Trigger/Action Group that contains the script action. Make any changes in the Indigo client.

Jay (Indigo Support)
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Posted on
Fri Nov 24, 2017 11:28 am
jltnol offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

Without a doubt, all of my exiting Applescripts involved controlling iTunes on the computer that runs iTunes and Airfoil, which is not the computer Indigo runs on. With the new version of AirFoil plugin, I've got even less Apple Scripts running... While I know everyone uses Indigo, iTunes, and Applescripts in different ways, the single missing piece for me is getting Indigo to manage iTunes Playlists. If/when Indigo can automatically play a designated playlist, I'd be off AppleScript 100%. That's my Holiday Wish!

Posted on
Sun Nov 26, 2017 9:23 pm
jay (support) offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

jltnol wrote:
Without a doubt, all of my exiting Applescripts involved controlling iTunes on the computer that runs iTunes and Airfoil, which is not the computer Indigo runs on. With the new version of AirFoil plugin, I've got even less Apple Scripts running... While I know everyone uses Indigo, iTunes, and Applescripts in different ways, the single missing piece for me is getting Indigo to manage iTunes Playlists. If/when Indigo can automatically play a designated playlist, I'd be off AppleScript 100%. That's my Holiday Wish!


As we pointed out, scripts that don't need to target the Indigo Server should run fine. It's unlikely that we'll be modifying the iTunes plugin unless/until Apple provides an API to do so. All of the other things out there (including our plugin) use reverse engineered information for control. We've implemented basic control but we're uncomfortable attempting to add any further functionality. We've already had one brush with Apple breaking it in iTunes 11 but were fortunate enough that someone else identified the issue and we were able to work around it.

Jay (Indigo Support)
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Posted on
Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:48 pm
jltnol offline
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Re: First AppleScript deprecation warning

Hey Jay

Totally understand... iTunes has been a mess for years... I've been looking for a viable substitute for years, and while some come close, none do everything that I need.

Good to hear external Applescripts will still work... or at least thats my understanding..

As usual, you guys do a great job with Indigo. :). Hats off!

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