7.5 - switching on lights randomly

Since I upgraded to 7.5 some lights just switch on magically. It happened with at least two lights about three times.

There was no command.

2021-01-15 12:11:24.514 Trigger Timestamp Wetter Online
2021-01-15 12:11:28.510 Z-Wave received "LED Sofa - Red" status update brightness 66
2021-01-15 12:11:28.513 Z-Wave received "LED Sofa - Green" status update brightness 30
2021-01-15 12:11:28.739 Z-Wave received "LED Sofa - Blue" status update brightness 40
2021-01-15 12:11:28.883 Z-Wave received "LED Sofa - White" status update brightness 66
2021-01-15 12:11:28.886 Z-Wave received "Licht Sofa" status update brightness 66

It might be unrelated, but I never had this before 7.5.

Using a zwave.me UZB1 Dongle and a Fibaro LED module.

There was no command.

Maybe try putting a Z-Wave watcher device on your magic devices. I don't think that will solve anything, but it should help get more information about zwave traffic and those devices.
https://www.indigodomo.com/pluginstore/43/

I haven't noticed any randomness with lighting since upgrading.... but I also live with 6 others, so lights/fans/tvs/etc are turning on/off constantly and I probably wouldn't notice.

[matt (support)]

You could also turn on Z-Wave debug logging for a day to capture at a lower-level what commands are being sent/received by Indigo around the time the problem occurs. Indigo log's most Z-Wave commands it sends but not all polling/status request commands are shown (unless you have debug logging enabled).

Hi
I to have this problem, and I have had it for years on and off.
I have done a lot of testing and logging and trouble shooting.
It has event got so far that the phenomena got a name in this house hold "the z-wave ghost".
My conclusions so far are that it's often caused by following:
*Moving around devices physically in the house (use the optimize function found under Interface->z-wave->Optimize z-wave network)
*New devices are added to the network (use the optimize function found under Interface->z-wave->Optimize z-wave network)
*Devices are removed from the network (use the optimize function found under Interface->z-wave->Optimize z-wave network)
*In conjunction to above I often get mysteries things added under Associations (Interface->z-wave->Manage Associations), here you need to primary check the troublesome devices by selecting it under "Controlling device" and check if any other devices are added in the group "Group 1, Group 2,......". You might even have to look in to every device and group. I'm not sure about the correct configuration here, but what works for me is to have only "001 - Indigo z-wave Interface" in every group on every device. This function can off course be used to associate devices, but I have never configured anything here so far, but I often find devices added here when the "z-wave ghost" is the house.
*This problem also often appears when another device is turned on, for me it has been two special Fibaro devices creating this scenario, one of them is a Fibaro RGBW. When I use a physical button to turn on one of the channels on the RGBW device, it also turns ON another device. The other scenario has been with me for a looong time, it's comes and goes. Logs are added below for this with debugging turned on. When I have "Kitchen Ceiling Light" (Fibaro dimmer) turn ON and walks in to my sittings room that is next door and turn ON "Sitting Room Dining Table Light" (Fibaro Double Relay) then for no reason, the kitchen light is turn OFF for about 5 seconds the it's turns ON again. This can be repeated if I turn OFF both devices and start over. BUT if I have the kitchen light ON (same as before) and instead of using the physical button connected to the Fibaro Double Relay, instead I use Indigo Touch interface and turn on sitting room light, it works as expected. This can work as fine for weeks or months and suddenly the "z-wave ghost" come and visit us...
I hope this gives you some advice and tips for things to look for. Matt if you have anything to add here please feel free to send me a message. I would really also love to solve this.

Z-Wave sent "Sitting Room Dining Table Light" off
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command sent (Node 11 Endpoint 1): 01 0E 00 13 0B 07 60 0D 01 01 25 01 00 25 B3 31 (True)
Z-Wave sent "Sitting Room TV Table Light" off
Z-Wave sent "Kitchen Ceiling Light" off
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command sent (Node 53): 01 0A 00 13 35 03 26 01 00 25 B5 67 (True)
Z-Wave sent "Sitting Room Dining Table Light" on
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command sent (Node 11 Endpoint 1): 01 0E 00 13 0B 07 60 0D 01 01 25 01 FF 25 BB C6 (True)
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 00 35 03 26 03 00 E1
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0F 00 04 00 35 09 71 05 00 00 00 FF 08 06 00 4D
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0C 00 04 00 35 06 31 05 04 22 00 00 D6
Z-Wave received "Kitchen Ceiling Light" status update brightness 100
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 00 35 03 26 03 63 82
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0C 00 04 00 35 06 31 05 04 22 02 26 F2

Feb 2, 2020 at 12:49:45 AM
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command sent (Node 53): 01 0A 00 13 35 03 32 01 00 25 CB 0D (True)
Z-Wave received "Kitchen Ceiling Light" energy total to 849.00 kWh
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 10 00 04 00 35 0A 32 02 21 44 00 01 4B A4 00 00 6F
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command sent (Node 53): 01 0A 00 13 35 03 32 01 10 25 CC 1A (True)
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0E 00 04 00 35 08 32 02 21 32 02 26 00 00 CF



Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 00 35 03 26 03 00 E1
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0F 00 04 00 35 09 71 05 00 00 00 FF 08 06 00 4D
Z-Wave received "Sitting Room Dining Table Light" status update is on
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 11): 01 09 00 04 00 0B 03 20 01 FF 24
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0C 00 04 00 35 06 31 05 04 22 00 00 D6
Z-Wave received "Kitchen Ceiling Light" status update brightness 51
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 00 35 03 26 03 32 D3
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0C 00 04 00 35 06 31 05 04 22 01 75 A2
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command sent (Node 53): 01 0A 00 13 35 03 32 01 00 25 A9 6F (True)
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 10 00 04 00 35 0A 32 02 21 44 00 01 4B D1 00 00 1A
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command sent (Node 53): 01 0A 00 13 35 03 32 01 10 25 AA 7C (True)
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0E 00 04 00 35 08 32 02 21 32 01 75 00 00 9F

[matt (support)]

It is a mystery. Your log doesn't show anything suspect from what I can tell. It sounds like the modules are getting random associations added, which then causes them to send commands to other modules commanding them. I'm not sure how that is happening. Sounds like a firmware bug or marginal hardware. If you have particular modules that get the random associations then you might try factory resetting those to see if that helps. The steps to reset them will be module specific, but for a lot of modules excluding/re-including them with the controller will reset them. You'll then need to re-sync them in Indigo (after they are re-included).

In my case the problem did not come back.

Hi Matt

By accident my daughter found a connection today, when she was running around and turning off lights.
I have made a adjustment to my Fibaro dimmer in Kitchen, it sets start dim level to 51% at a certain time of the day.
In the log below you can see that I start the Kitchen light at 51%.
When I press a second time on dim up, it will dim to 100%
If I after this turn on the living room light, the kitchen light will turn off and on after about 2-5 seconds, you can see in the log that status update is off and status update is on.

If I reset and just turn on kitchen light to 51% and then turn on living room light, nothing happens..

I you last response you recommended to exclude and reinclude the and re-sync, can you please tell me more about how to re-sync?
You'll then need to re-sync them in Indigo (after they are re-included).

One other thing, I really try to avoid using new z-wave addresses, I'm already at 144 and counting, there are a lot (30-40) unused after problematic devices.
If I remember correctly, there is a maximum of 255 addresses, what will happen when I get to 255 but still have available addresses?


Z-Wave received "Kitchen Ceiling Light" status update is on
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 08 35 03 20 01 FF 12
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 00 35 03 20 01 FF 1A
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0A 00 04 08 35 04 26 01 FF 01 11
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0A 00 04 00 35 04 26 01 FF 01 19
Z-Wave received "Kitchen Ceiling Light" status update brightness 51
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 00 35 03 26 03 32 D3
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0C 00 04 00 35 06 31 05 04 22 00 B7 61
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 08 35 03 20 01 FF 12
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 00 35 03 20 01 FF 1A
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0A 00 04 08 35 04 26 01 FF 01 11
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0A 00 04 00 35 04 26 01 FF 01 19
Z-Wave received "Kitchen Ceiling Light" status update brightness 100
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 00 35 03 26 03 63 82
Z-Wave received "Kitchen Ceiling Light" status update is off
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 00 35 03 26 03 00 E1
Z-Wave received "Sitting Room Dining Table Light" status update is on
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 11): 01 09 00 04 00 0B 03 25 03 FF 23
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0F 00 04 00 35 09 71 05 00 00 00 FF 08 06 00 4D
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command sent (Node 53): 01 0A 00 13 35 03 32 01 00 25 1D DB (True)
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 10 00 04 00 35 0A 32 02 21 44 00 01 69 E2 00 00 0B
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command sent (Node 53): 01 0A 00 13 35 03 32 01 10 25 1E C8 (True)
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0E 00 04 00 35 08 32 02 21 32 00 B7 00 00 5C
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0C 00 04 00 35 06 31 05 04 22 00 00 D6
Z-Wave received "Kitchen Ceiling Light" status update brightness 100
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 09 00 04 00 35 03 26 03 63 82
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command sent (Node 53): 01 0A 00 13 35 03 32 01 00 25 1F D9 (True)
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 10 00 04 00 35 0A 32 02 21 44 00 01 69 E2 00 00 0B
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0C 00 04 00 35 06 31 05 04 22 02 3F EB
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command sent (Node 53): 01 0A 00 13 35 03 32 01 10 25 20 F6 (True)
Z-Wave Watcher Debug Raw command received (Node 53): 01 0E 00 04 00 35 08 32 02 21 32 02 3F 00 00 D6

[matt (support)]

By re-sync I just mean pressing the Define and Sync... button inside the device dialog, select new new node ID (if it changed), and then pressing Sync.

What you are describing with the Fibaro sounds like a current overload protection feature. Check the Fibaro manual – they have a ton of different settings, and I believe some of them have parameters that can set a maximum load threshold. Indigo may not show UI in the device settings dialog for all of those settings, but you can always change them manually via the Interfaces->Z-Wave->Modify Configuration Parameter... menu item.

The Z-Wave controller will automatically re-use older node ID slots that are are no longer being used (because the module was excluded).

Hi again

First, I will apologies for steeling this tread. If we can't continue in this tread, please tell me and I will create a new.

To continue where we left of.
I guess you suspect overload because when it turns to 100% it turns of. That is not the case, If I turn it on to 100% and don't turn on the light in my living room nothing will happen.

I have continued my investigations, trying to rule out things.
Today another ghost problem occurred. I have a trigger that turns on lights when I open my front door, suddenly new lights turn on and off.
I tried to think of a way to troubleshoot this problem and I got an idea, I guess if this problem in my z-wave devices, the problem will show up even if I stop the Indigo server and let the z-wave USB stick stay in the USB port.
If the problem doesn’t show up when the Indigo server is stopped, this problem is linked to Indigo I guess?
Correct me if I’m wrong.
The new problem is linked to a "Disco" trigger I have, the “Disco” trigger is trigged by a secondary light switch on a dual relay Fibaro device that doesn't have a load connected to the secondary switch.
The "Disco" trigger it self will turn on one light and turn off three.
The "Disco" trigger is now suddenly triggered and another kitchen dinner table light (doesn't show in the log) when my front door is opened instead of the regular trigger.
I also tested to disable the “Disco” trigger, and guess what, now the lights triggered by the disco trigger didn’t change state.

The log doesn’t help much, is only show that it’s triggered. (See log below)
Any help here is appreciated.

Z-Wave received "Hallway Entre Door Sensor" status update is on
Trigger CPV1-Hallway Entre Door - Update Variable Open
Z-Wave received "Living Room Disco Lights" status update is on
Trigger CPV1-Living Room Disco Lights
Z-Wave sent "Living Room PDU03 Outlet 5 - Discolight" on
Z-Wave sent "Living Room Ceiling Light" off
Z-Wave sent "Living Room Smal Ceiling Light" off
Z-Wave sent "Living Room Large Ceiling Light" off
Z-Wave received "Hallway Entre Door Sensor" status update is off
Trigger CPV1-Hallway Entre Door - Update Variable Closed
Z-Wave received "Kitchen Fan Control" status update brightness 100
Z-Wave received "Living Room PDU03 Outlet 5 - Discolight" power load to 3.8 W
Z-Wave received "Living Room Disco Lights" status update is off
Trigger CPV1-Living Room Disco Lights
Z-Wave sent "Living Room PDU03 Outlet 5 - Discolight" off
Z-Wave sent "Living Room Ceiling Light" off
Z-Wave sent "Living Room Smal Ceiling Light" off
Z-Wave send "Living Room Large Ceiling Light" off

[matt (support)]

I tried to think of a way to troubleshoot this problem and I got an idea, I guess if this problem in my z-wave devices, the problem will show up even if I stop the Indigo server and let the z-wave USB stick stay in the USB port. If the problem doesn’t show up when the Indigo server is stopped, this problem is linked to Indigo I guess?

Yes, if the problem goes away without Indigo Server running that would at least mean Indigo is somehow involved in the problem occurring.

I also tested to disable the “Disco” trigger, and guess what, now the lights triggered by the disco trigger didn’t change state.

What happens if you execute (via the button on the Main Window) the actions for the Disco trigger? Does it happen every time they are executed (try doing it 10 times)?
If that causes the problem, then duplicate the Trigger 4 times, edit the actions for each duplicate so that each only has 1 of the actions. You can then narrow down which action causes it.

Lastly, re-sync all of the modules involved and check the Event Log to see if any associations are read out that shouldn't be there.

I had the same problem with 7.5, I noticed unwanted behaviour of some ligts but the event log showed the additional message "from associate" . This way I found out that one of the Fibaro RGBW modules had several "self initiated" associations with a lot of other devices in a building. I removed these associations and it appears to be ok now.