My favorite fruit company no more.

This is not a post to ask when will Indigo 7 be released. Frankly I'm kinda glad it's not out yet... I have stuff to do and a new mac to buy. My old Mac Mini is seriously outdated... probably about 12 years old. And that is the subject of this post.

I'm kinda disgusted with Apple right now. I don't know if it's Tim Cook, or what's happening but from a source ZDNet (through MacRumors data), here is what we are looking at currently since the last product refreshes on the Mac:

"Just how bad is Apple's lineup? Here's data collated by MacRumors on how long it's been since the different lines were updated (correct at time of writing):

MacBook - 177 days
iMac - 366 days
Retina MacBook Pro - 513 days
MacBook Air - 584 days
Mac mini - 728 days
Mac Pro - 1,029 days
MacBook Pro - 1,584 days"

For home automation, I prefer a computer without an attached screen because I log on to it with a macbook Air which I can carry anywhere in the home for working on the system... so this gives me a choice between a Mac Mini or a Mac Pro. I HAVE a Mac Pro... two of them... one 2008 and the other 2009... both of them are obsolete with respect to the latest mac operating systems. Plus, these computers start at $2999. So that leads to a Mac Mini... with it's soldered down memory and low feature set, it's still just what Indigo needs.

Notice that these products are 728 days and 1029-days out of refresh????

Now I hear that the next refresh for any Macs may not occur until Spring 2017. SPRING 2017? I also hear that the Mac Mini might be going bye-bye.

Tim Cook is no Steve Jobs but why is Apple coasting? This is not helping Apple. My strategy so far has been to hold out for the new Mac Mini but I'm beyond turning blue and I'm beginning to think that Apple has lost its marbles.

[jay (support)]

There are a lot of things going on at Apple that leaves one scratching their head, I agree. Near the top of my list is the seemingly endless parade of poor quality initial OS releases. 10.6 was the last totally solid OS version AT INITIAL RELEASE (including iOS as well). Been down-hill since then IMO.

Of course, one has to look at Apple as a whole - Mac revenue is small and diminishing as a contributor. Not an excuse, but probably part of their internal justification. I wouldn't be surprised if both the Mac Pro and the mini disappeared, unless educational sales of the mini are fairly high. I doubt anything can save the Pro...

[MODERATOR NOTE] moved to a more appropriate forum

I'm not going to argue with your refresh dates, except including the MacBook Pro (non Retina) is silly. It's an obsolete machine that will never be refreshed. I'm frankly surprised it still available at all.

Consensus seems to be that the MBP and MBA will get refreshed within weeks at most. I've been putting off a MBP purchase for almost a year waiting for it. My current MBP is a 2010 model.

I think the mini has gotten a speed bump or two in that time, but no other changes. And I do wonder if there's any good reason to do anything else to that form factor. If it does ever get a redesign, it's probably going to go the way of the MacBook. USB-C and maybe Thunderbolt. And maybe nothing else. Is that what I want anyway?

I suspect, on a day to day basis, this is way below Tim's radar. Bob Mansfield used to be head of Mac HW, and then he got moved to Titan (car) which now appears to be shutting down. Will he go back to Mac HW?

What's the industry trend in PC hardware these days? Cheaper and cheaper, no differentiation, crap hardware? That's what it seems to me. Is there a market for premium hardware anymore?

I saw that article too and refactored:

MacBook - less than 6 months
iMac - 1 year
Retina MacBook Pro - 1 year, 5 months
MacBook Air - 1 year, 7 months
Mac mini - 2 years
Mac Pro - 2 years, 10 months
MacBook Pro - over 4 years

To me, it's really the Mac Mini on that are a question mark. My newest machine is 3 years old and does everything I need. My oldest machine is 6 years old and is still able to run El Capitan.

Don't get me wrong--I get your frustration. I just think that the article was a bit disingenuous and click-baity.

Looking at this trend:
I believe indigo needs to move to a more open platform in the long run. May be a RPI v4 with real hard disk. I know this is likely after i8

Karl


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The sense I have is that Apple would be nuts to back out of the Mac market, but with no place to go but cheaper? Well that isn't their style either. You know, everything is ripe and perfect for a real knock it out of the park Jarvis like assistant. Perhaps the Mac OS becoming a part of the iPhone in time.

One product I imagine all the time and expect soon is a mac OS based "listening" client which just kinda hangs out and listens to what's going on. As it hears what's happening in the room, it pulls up video's and data sheets and information and presents it right there in front of your face (in 3D someday)... imagine an office meeting with something like this in the table... and as the engineers discuss the product, the part data sheets, 3D diagrams, and information all presents itself.... available to you on command or at arm's length.

The same virtual space could find it's way into schools and playpens. It's not as if there is no future for computers and computing. Home Automation is just one frontier.

There's most definitely future markets for Apple... if they were interested, but if Steve Jobs where here, he wouldn't let them kill off the Mac just yet. Tim Cook has it on life-support IMO.

Note: About that Mac Pro.... I would be surprised to see it go. The music, movie, and graphics art industries depend on it... and education.

[jay (support)]

Note: About that Mac Pro.... I would be surprised to see it go. The music, movie, and graphics art industries depend on it... and education.

I'd be very surprised if education is buying them in any quantity given the price point. The movie industry uses rendering farms for the heavy lifting and those are definitely not Macs. Music production generally doesn't require that level of power. And the iMac is quickly catching up with the necessary horsepower for those industries (many are already using high-end iMacs with Retina displays). IMO...

The Mac isn't going away any time soon. But I think the outlier Macs will probably be the next to go. Macs as we know them will eventually fade away, but not soon.

Oh, one more prognostication: the MacBook Air brand will go away in favor of a cheaper version of the MacBook. I just don't see having two so similar product lines continuing.

I think the Mac Pro is a goner as is the Mini - although the footprint of the Mini is appealing to many and the Apple TV is nearly the same, we could see them converge. The iMac will prevail in the desktop arena and you can see from the pattern that the MacBook Pro is being morphed into the MacBook Air. The Air is so underpowered and underwhelming I think that will go away when the Pro can compete with it on weight better (which gets closer every redesign).

I gave up my Air for a MacBook Pro because the Airs horsepower was more like kitten-power instead. I also retired my Mac Pro at the same time and use the MacBook Pro for both tasks and have been pretty happy. I have the dual video version and that extra 3GB video memory makes a huge difference and if it didn't have that I wouldn't have gone down this path.

Apple is no longer much of an innovator, Jobs was the creative one and Tim Cook is, in my opinion, a total asshat who is about as worthless as can be. He offers little to nothing to Apple and spends more time championing his social and political causes than he does actually doing anything for Apple. The Watch was all Jobs, and without his vision (and ability to trim the product line to ensure Apple stayed a superior brand) then Apple's future is bleak.

The iPhone 7 is just purely a waste and you know they are "saving up" for that 10th anniversary iPhone next year and their big whammy will be to include features that Androids have already been sporting for the past 6 months.

I stay with Apple right now because I like the interface and usability and I think the ecosystem of Apple devices is far beyond what can be done reasonably well with PC's. But I can see myself flopping back to PC's in the future if the current trends continue. I was willing to foot the EXTREMELY overpriced product line while the product was superior but I'm just not sure of that anymore. I could have purchased a VASTLY superior laptop to the one I did for the same or less money and at this rate of development my next laptop WILL be a PC.

What's the industry trend in PC hardware these days? Cheaper and cheaper, no differentiation, crap hardware? That's what it seems to me. Is there a market for premium hardware anymore?

Well, to be fair I don't think that is really a trend - it has been steady at that for a long time in the consumer space; there are still a couple of niche high performance, good quality vendors out there - but the majority of the high performance machines are probably custom made from components. So easy to do on the non-Mac side of things. Business hardware is still pretty good quality if you look for it - but you will pay a slight premium AND aren't looking at gaming-style performance but rather business oriented (e.g. less emphasis on graphics cards and multimedia features).

I've been pretty unsatisfied with Apple's computer hardware ever since the MacPro went to the trashcan design... used to be that was a high quality, very customizable machine. I run an older, but upgraded (CPU/RAM/USB/Video Cards) MacPro and still love it. But it will eventually wear out and need replacing - I just hope that isn't for years! I don't want to pay for a MacBook but that is the likely next option unless I go back to Windows for my main machine. Windows 10 fixed a LOT that was wrong with previous versions, so that is a viable option. I'll always have a mixed environment anyway.

"Just how bad is Apple's lineup? Here's data collated by MacRumors on how long it's been since the different lines were updated (correct at time of writing):

MacBook - 177 days
iMac - 366 days
Retina MacBook Pro - 513 days
MacBook Air - 584 days
Mac mini - 728 days
Mac Pro - 1,029 days
MacBook Pro - 1,584 days"

Here we are

I'd suspect they wouldn't discontinue the mini as it is a successful gateway product. Historically first time owners of minis have upgraded to iMacs or MacBooks at a faster rate than existing MacBook or iMac users have to newer versions of their products. That doesn't mean though that they'll update them, I don't think the age of said product has done much to taint their desirability. Of course a price drop would always be welcome..

Of course a price drop would always be welcome..

Absolutely and they can get rid of the Mac Mini alltogether if Apple wants to make Mac Pro's available for Mac Mini prices. I've been thinking about how the Mac Mini is really too big and should be shaped like a hockey puck.... and then Amazon released the dot. More to Jay's point on the Mac Pro's going away, I actually spent 15 years in research at the University of Utah and became familiar with how research (tax) dollars are spent. It may be surprising to some how many Mac Pro's there are on grad student and professor desks. Also places like JPL, Berkley and NASA (anyplace government money flows freely) tend to gravitate to the Mac Pro side of the Apple Universe... along with a Mac laptop side-kicker.

The main reason I'm writing is this C|Net announcement which came in my email last night:

"Apple's new Macs may be unveiled October 27
https://www.cnet.com/news/apple-october ... cupertino/

Had I realized I had such power I would have spoken earlier. No mention of Mac Mini's... of course.

... and there is the fact that IBM will have deployed 100,000 new Macs by the end of the year (having started last year)...

... and there is the fact that IBM will have deployed 100,000 new Macs by the end of the year (having started last year)...

Good point, Cisco is all Apple now too. At this event I'm at this week (Gartner Symposium), casual observation shows about 50/50 Macs and PCs. Most of the PCs are MS Surfaces.

Terry

... and there is the fact that IBM will have deployed 100,000 new Macs by the end of the year (having started last year)...

I wonder what opd stevie would have thought of that..