Page 1 of 2

IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 9:39 am
by tazswe
Beginning of next year IKEA will launcher automatic blinds. They will be affordable and controlled by Zigbee.
https://www.channelnews.com.au/ikea-tip ... rt-blinds/

The big companies are using Zigbee while we are stuck with Z-wave :|

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 8:23 am
by howartp
Who are you calling big companies?

IKEA are a retail outlet selling their own furniture/etc, not a big Smart Automation company like Aeon/Aeotech/Fibaro.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 11:27 am
by jay (support)
tazswe wrote:
The big companies are using Zigbee while we are stuck with Z-wave :|


Yeah, I gotta disagree here. Zigbee still has smallish market penetration in the DIY sector compared to Z-Wave.

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 11:59 am
by tazswe
howartp wrote:
Who are you calling big companies?

IKEA are a retail outlet selling their own furniture/etc, not a big Smart Automation company like Aeon/Aeotech/Fibaro.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


FIBARO 150 employes

AEON LABS +500 employes

PHILIPS 114000 employes

IKEA 194000 employes

XIAOMI 3rd biggest producer of mobile phones

Fibaro and Aeon Labs was small companies that no one had heard of a couple of years ago. They had big influence on the first wave of companies looking into home automation.

No are we looking at the second wave with companies like Philips, IKEA, Xiamoi, Apple, Samsung.

Lightbulbs are an important piece of the home automation market and they have already choosen zigbee.



Skickat från min iPad med Tapatalk

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:02 pm
by tazswe
jay (support) wrote:
tazswe wrote:
The big companies are using Zigbee while we are stuck with Z-wave :|


Yeah, I gotta disagree here. Zigbee still has smallish market penetration in the DIY sector compared to Z-Wave.


You mean that the turnover of lightbulbs with zigbee is negligible?


Skickat från min iPad med Tapatalk

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:13 pm
by kw123
It’s a normal development. Constantly changing. First it was insteon then zwave next zigbi WiFi ..
That’s the cool thing about this area always changing and the winners are not set yet

And the large companies moving in just have market dominance as their advantage not speed.

I looked at ikea and their technology looks interesting but still limited devices. No switches yet only lights and dimmers but they are adding

The future is bright.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:14 pm
by howartp
kw123 wrote:
The future is bright.

Pun intended? :-)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:24 pm
by kw123
UniFi now has poe lighting
But you need to recable everything.

May be in the next new house I build That’s like not happening anytime soon.

And yes it’s bright


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:35 pm
by jay (support)
tazswe wrote:
jay (support) wrote:
tazswe wrote:
The big companies are using Zigbee while we are stuck with Z-wave :|


Yeah, I gotta disagree here. Zigbee still has smallish market penetration in the DIY sector compared to Z-Wave.


You mean that the turnover of lightbulbs with zigbee is negligible?


Bulbs with smarts in them have significantly smaller market penetration than switches controlling dumb bulbs. And in the much larger switch/dumb bulb market Zigbee is still playing catchup. Not that some day it won't catch up (we actually hope it does because the APIs are better) but that's not where the market is now, and frankly Zigbee isn't making a lot of progress in that direction especially in the DIY market.

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:41 pm
by tazswe
lanbrown wrote:
tazswe wrote:

Lightbulbs are an important piece of the home automation market and they have already choosen zigbee.

Skickat från min iPad med Tapatalk


Sure they are, but I'd rather control the switch than individual light bulbs. Guess what, Zigbee isn't free and why keep having to buy bulbs with smarts when you buy the switch and it works with all bulbs on the chain and future bulbs as well.

I view smart bulbs as an interim step before PoE is used. Think about it, PoE is now capable of 100 watts; so that is a lot of lighting power when you look at LED bulbs. On a single cable you have control (Ethernet) and then power PoE. With ZigBee you need both 110 (or 220 for other parts of the world) for power and then Zigbee for control.

The only advantage that having a smart bulb brings is that they are quicker to install than a replacement switch. However, you are looking at $10 to $20 per Zigbee bulb. I have about 26 indoor spotlight bulbs over 10 different circuits. $20 x 26 = $520 if I go with bulbs. A Z-Wave switch is around $40; so $40 x 10 = $400. Not a surprise that replacing a switch is cheaper.

If there is one light in a switch, Zigbee is cheaper. If there are multiple lights on a switch; then Z-wave is typically going to be cheaper.

I personally have no interest in buying smart bulbs; I'd rather control the switch, not the bulb.


You are an enthusiast with the knowledge how to change a switch and you are not unique on this forum, it’s filled with nerds.
I am the same but we don’t represent the future mass market.
If the mass market (that can’t change a switch )will choose lightbulbs that can handle zigbee a lot of new applications will also choose zigbee because they will focus on the mass market and not a few thousand nerds that are playing with a controller that can’t handle zigbee.


Skickat från min iPad med Tapatalk

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:50 pm
by tazswe
jay (support) wrote:
tazswe wrote:
jay (support) wrote:
tazswe wrote:
The big companies are using Zigbee while we are stuck with Z-wave :|


Yeah, I gotta disagree here. Zigbee still has smallish market penetration in the DIY sector compared to Z-Wave.


You mean that the turnover of lightbulbs with zigbee is negligible?


Bulbs with smarts in them have significantly smaller market penetration than switches controlling dumb bulbs. And in the much larger switch/dumb bulb market Zigbee is still playing catchup. Not that some day it won't catch up (we actually hope it does because the APIs are better) but that's not where the market is now, and frankly Zigbee isn't making a lot of progress in that direction especially in the DIY market.


Interesting because I would say that market for Philips Hue and IKEA bulbs are more likely 100 than 10 times bigger than the z-wave switch market in Scandinavia.




Skickat från min iPad med Tapatalk

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 6:17 am
by elov
I got two IKEA KADRILJ blinds and thought about the integration to my Indigo setup.
When I get some time to play, I'll give pytradfri a try since i bought a Trådfri Gateway. https://github.com/ggravlingen/pytradfri
But a Zigbee USB stick directly with indigo would be more sleek in the long run.

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2019 11:05 am
by shapa
Made some basic integration via pytradfri - works OK, full control

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Tue Dec 31, 2019 9:38 am
by Espressomatic
Z-Wave is tiny at retail. It's what I use almost exclusively, but I'm not fooling myself into thinking it's not almost a non-player today in the market.

tazswe wrote:
Interesting because I would say that market for Philips Hue and IKEA bulbs are more likely 100 than 10 times bigger than the z-wave switch market in Scandinavia.


Yes, they're big. Globally, IKEA sells more smart components than all dedicated HA companies like Fibaro, Aeotec, etc. combined. And by a lot more than 100 times. I would guess conservatively it's 1000-10k times more in units and even higher in dollars. Philips are huge too, but IKEA is going to surpass them, even in bulbs. They've recently promoted their Home Smart division to primary status. They have an IKEA-jargon name for this, but basically, it's promoted to top-line business unit, running at the same top level with Kitchens, Bath, etc.

Re: IKEA BLINDS

PostPosted: Sat Jan 18, 2020 7:40 am
by petematheson
So if I was about to buy some Ikea blinds, they all work with Indigo as long as I get the Ikea gateway?