Qubino ZMNHDD Slow

... However, it takes up to 5 seconds holding the switch down for Indigo to receive the notification, which as I want to use it to toggle other lights on or off is not going to be acceptable to my users (aka my wife) .
Should it be that slow?...

Unfortunately yes, that is my experience as well with these Qubino modules. See my post in this thread:
http://forums.indigodomo.com/viewtopic.php?p=143301#p143301 where I wrote

"Note that the updates for I2 and I3 can be 4-5 seconds delayed in both the GUI and log. This is NOT an Indigo issue but rather a poor firmware design by Qubino. I do see the same delays with other platforms as well (OpenZwave Controller Panel for example)"

If I understand you correctly you are using a 3-way switch connected to I1 and I3? That is actually wrong, if you want to use 3-way switch then it should be connected to I1 and I2. Input 3 is meant to be used with for example a normally open/normally closed sensor like a door sensor or a motion sensor.
See the manual at for example http://www.vesternet.com/downloads/dl/file/id/1323/product/1559/z_wave_qubino_flush_dimmer_plus_user_manual_v1_5.pdf where you can see that I3 is not used for push buttons or bi stable buttons. Only I1 and I2 is configurable for buttons. See also under parameter 20 description where it says:

Parameter no. 20 – Enable/Disable 3way switch.
Dimming is done by push button or switch connected to I1 (by default). Enabling 3way switch, dimming can be controlled by push button or switch connected to I1 and I2.

If you want to trigger turn on of another lamp controlled by another module when you trigger on the ZMNHDDx then you should instead use direct association method and set up a direct association between the ZMNHDDx (as the controlling device) and the other device(s) you want to control being the controlled devices. This is the way I have my system setup. You will have minimal delay with this method.

Hi,
Thanks for your reply. I have this correctly wired, ie the 3 position switch is wired to I1 and I2 and works fine, and immediately. I guess that because the parameter for 3 position switch is enabled, it reports I3 on end point 2.

I have looked at associations, and unfortunately the 2 light circuits I want to control are controlled by a Flush 2 relay and I seem to only be able to control Q1 with associations, and even in that case, associating the dimmer endpoint 2, ie group 2 (although tried group 3 as well) with the flush 2 relay device didnt work.

Looking at the manual, it does say that I2 and I3 are compatible with switches. I have asked Qubino support about it. I'm wondering about the value of parameter 101 being 9 rather than 1-6 makes any difference?

Notes for the diagram:
N + VDC
L - VDC
Output for electrical device
I3 Input for switch/push button or sensor
I2 Input for switch/push button or sensor
I1 Input for push button/switch

Hmm ok but I am not really following you completely in what you are trying to do here now...

To clarify:
1. You have 3-way pushbuttons connected to I1 and I2 and parameter 20 is set to 1?

2. You want to control BOTH input 1 and 2 (Q1 and Q2) of a Fibaro Flush 2x relay or a Qubino Flush 2x relay FROM the Qubino Flush Dimmer ZMNHDD?

3. Do you ONLY want to activate the 2 light groups connected to the two flush 2x relays when you press the 2nd push button, i.e. the one connected to I2 of the flush dimmer?

Remember though that as I mentioned above that notification reports (from I2 and I3 state changes when param 100 and 101 are anything else than zero) are indeed slow out from the Qubino devices.

I suspect also that you can not have BOTH I2 and I3 notification reports enabled and at the same time have 3-way switch enabled since 3-way switch will use I2 input.
If I have a 3-way switch connected and parameter 20 set to 1 then I would only enable I3 notification reports (i.e. parameter 100 = 0 and parameter 101=9)

I might be able to test multiassocations from ZMNHDD to a 2x flush relay later this weekend.

A final resort would be to create a rule within Indigo that activates both outputs of your 2x flush relay as soon as your ZMNHDD dimmer changes from value = 0 to anything higher than zero.

I have 4 light circuits in the kitchen, Spots1, Spot2, LED Strips and Pendants.
Spots 1 is controlled by dimmer(1) with I1 and I2 with parameter 20 set with 3 position switch A
Spots 2 is controlled by dimmer(2) with I1 and I2 with parameter 20 set with 3 position switch B
LED strips is controlled by Q1 on Flush 2 relay with toggle switch C
Pendants is controlled by Q2 on same Flush 2 relay. with toggle switch D

Switch E is momentary switch wired to dimmer(1) I3
Switch F is momentary switch wired to dimmer(2) I3

Switches A, B, E, F are next to the kitchen door, the switches C and D are the other side of the room. Whilst I can ask Alexa to turn on those lights without walking over, I would like to use E and F to control the LED strip lights and pendants. I do the same thing, via associations with a fibaro dimmer in my lounge.

It does sound like this slow notification for Qubino is known, but I dont understand why they would implement it that way.

All I am thinking now is to replace E and F as toggle switches (its a Click grid switch system) so that you dont have to stand there and hold it, and I can set a Trigger based on any change on that switch, but it will still have a delay.

Aaah clearer now.

If I would set up that scenario I would not use push buttons (or bi-stable buttons) connected to dimmer 1 input I3 and dimmer 2 input I3.

I would either use a battery operated radio button at the place for E and F switch OR a transmitter connected to the E and F push buttons.

If you already have push buttons E and F installed and you have space behind the buttons I would use this device to control the LED strips and pendant lights:
http://www.vesternet.com/z-wave-everspr ... all-remote

If you accept battery operated wall controllers I would use:
http://www.vesternet.com/z-wave-popp-wallcontroller
https://www.m.nu/fjarrkontroller/fynd-wallmote-quad

I use these even though they are somewhat problematic to include into Indigo but I really love the design and the possibility to use different colors on the paddles and different styles of frames (I have anthracite paddles with brushed steel frames) (Swedish only sorry):
https://www.m.nu/fjarrkontroller/schnei ... ppa-z-wave
https://www.m.nu/fjarrkontroller/schnei ... por-z-wave

Do you always want to turn on the LED strip and pendants when you turn on either dimmer 1 and dimmer 2?
If yes then I would use direct associations (which you say does not work with 2x flush relays, I´ll test also though) OR create trigger in Indigo. There would be a small delay but not at all as long as the 4-5 secondswhen using the notifications from the ZMNHDD-dimmer.
If not then i would use any of the switches suggested above for the positions E and F to control the LED strips and pendants.

Thanks. The everspring unit looks good, and other than appearing out of stock everywhere, doesnt solve the problem of the Flush 2 Relay allowing assocations to control Q2 (unless thats an Indigo limitation?)

I like the wallmote but my wife ddoesnt, and the only way I got her to agree to these switches is that the Click minigrid ones I bought were the same style as our existing ones.

I think I will need switch to toggle switches and live with the delay, but at least I know that if someone presses the switch it will respond, albeit slow, rather than someone only holding the toggle switch for 3 seconds and it not working.

Then hassle Qubino to find out why the notifications are so slow.

I tested with Qubino 2x flush relay yesterday and you are correct indeed, there is no way to select relay no 2/input Q2 of the relay when doing direct association from a dimmer to the relay.

As far as I can read out from the Z-Wave protocol specs it should be possible to do multi channel associations.
0x8E = COMMAND_CLASS_MULTI_CHANNEL_ASSOCIATION

Read page 108 and 123 in the document SDS13782-3 Z-Wave Management Command Class Specification (2017-07-10) that describes Multi Channel Association Command Class, version 2:
http://zwavepublic.com/sites/default/files/command_class_specs_2017A/SDS13782-3%20Z-Wave%20Management%20Command%20Class%20Specification.pdf

Ah, I found this interesting text at http://manuals.fibaro.com/knowledge-base-browse/associations/
"Multi-channel associations: When a z-Wave device has more than one endpoint (port) it often enables multi-channel association function. It is a function of setting associations between specific endpoints. The great example of a multiple-port device is FIBARO Relay Switch 2 x 1,5 Kw. It enables Z-Wave to control two independent lights or appliances. If you want to individually control each port, you can do this through multi-channel associations. In this case both devices have to support multi-channel associations function."

So this means that both the ZMNHDD dimmer AND the devices you want to do associations with must support the 0x8E multi channel association command class.
According to the manuals both the ZMNHDD flush dimmer and the flush 2x relay (ZMNHBD) supports COMMAND_CLASS_MULTI_CHANNEL_ASSOCIATION_V3 so it should be possible to do association from your dimmer to the flush 2 relay that you want to control from the dimmer.

@Mattt: Maybe you can explain further if this is something Indigo could implement?

Cheers... that would definitely solve some of my problems, if I can find those devices anywhere!

I heard back from Qubino support, and they confirmed there is a delay in notifications on the I2 and I3 and said there would be on the association too. However they confirmed which association group to use, which was 8, I had been testing a different one, and using that, the response is immediate which is great, and contradicts what they said. Interestingly though, it activates both Q1 and Q2 on the relay.
Thats not the end of the world, and definitely a step up on the delay, and is useful functionality but would be great to be able to split the functionality of Q1 and Q2 across the 2 different dimmers. If not, I will have to think about what I can use the other I3 input for, and one that can be associated and not rely on a notification and trigger.

[matt (support)]

So this means that both the ZMNHDD dimmer AND the devices you want to do associations with must support the 0x8E multi channel association command class.
According to the manuals both the ZMNHDD flush dimmer and the flush 2x relay (ZMNHBD) supports COMMAND_CLASS_MULTI_CHANNEL_ASSOCIATION_V3 so it should be possible to do association from your dimmer to the flush 2 relay that you want to control from the dimmer.

@Mattt: Maybe you can explain further if this is something Indigo could implement?

That sounds correct. I just provided some details on this post which might help get it working.