Fakro Roof Windows - Zwave Function

Hello,
I've recently bought a new Fakro roof light and installed it in our bathroom.
http://www.fakro.co.uk/products/all-products/electric-control/remote-control/zwp10/

I chose this model as it came with a Zwave compatible controller, so i could open and close it remotely. However since pairing the device with Indigo, I can only get control of the open and close function, but not stop. Once the window has started opening / closing I can't stop it until its fully open or closed. The remote that came with the window (ZWP10) has a stop function, so I was hoping that indigo would have the same. Indigo has a sliding %age scale but this only works at ether 0 or 100%
Am i doing something wrong or is indigo not programmed to recognise the Fakro roof lights?

Thanks in advance for your help, i'm a little new to the whole Zwave thing.

Cheers
Martin

Hi Martin,

I have been using four of these Fakro winders in clerestory windows at home, and have found them to be satisfactory - after I had to shorten the chain due to physical limits to opening of the window that they're fitted to

You can stop the windows by issuing a raw zwave command 0x26, 0x05.

I do this by creating an Action Group, of type "Send Raw Z-Wave Command (Z-Wave Actions)", then "Edit Action Settings" to the target device (the window device) and Payload bytes 0x26, 0x05. Sounds more complex than it is!

I am awy from direct access to the server so am unable to send screen shots, but can do so if you can't "crack the code"!

I then have a button on the control page that calls the Action Group. There does not appear to be anyway currently to use a slider to position the window as is possible with the Fibaro Home Centre. If positioning is important (in my case it isn't) you could possibly create an action group that issued a start command and then a stop command at some time after - providing you start from a known position ie either fully open or fully closed. Not precise, but probably good enough for general window application.

If it's any comfort, I too experienced this problem, until Jay pointed me to the Somfy commands, elsewhere on this forum!! Evidently there is some standardisation amongst the fenestration crowd!!

I am currently considering automating windows in a renovation project. Given the cost of the Fakro winders here "downunder", I am looking at the alternative of lower cost winders without Z-Wave built in and using a Fibaro double switch in-wall module, or the lower cost alternative of ESP wifi modules in conjunction with Karl's excellent arduino plugin. Early days yet - I'll post an update when/if the project progresses

Good luck, and regards,

Mclass.


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Hi Martin,
I am currently considering automating windows in a renovation project. Given the cost of the Fakro winders here "downunder", I am looking at the alternative of lower cost winders without Z-Wave built in and using a Fibaro double switch in-wall module, or the lower cost alternative of ESP wifi modules in conjunction with Karl's excellent arduino plugin. Early days yet - I'll post an update when/if the project progresses

FYI Qubino do a motor control device (Flush Shutter )which can control Topp ACK44 window openers, both 240v or 24V. http://qubino.com/products/flush-shutter/

Colin

Fantastic, that works. Thanks Mclass
I've not used RAW commands before, i must look up more about it. I now have a control page with open, close and stop.

Thanks again
Martin

sending the raw z-wave command as part of an action sequence works brilliantly to stop the window over-opening. thanks.

One disadvantage of the Fakro openers is that they are quite noisy.

I've stumbled across the full instructions for the Fakro ZWS units, and have found a comment that they operate more quietly at slow speed. Configuration parameter 7 controls speed - values 1,2,3,4 run from slowest to maximum speed.

So I thought it would be simple to adjust the speed parameter accordingly to try this out....however under the 'modify configuration parameters' dialogue, the Fakro device does not appear at all. It is working perfectly in other respects, and I have resynced just in case....

Any reason why the Fakro isn't appearing?

Hi,

I just checked my Fakro winders, and they do not appear to support COMMAND_CLASS_CONFIGURATION (0x70).
This was discussed in another thread about a different device:
http://forums.indigodomo.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=17932
Note that in that thread, Jay suggested

but you could try excluding the module then re-including it with encryption (via the Define and Sync dialog). Some modules support different command classes when included with encryption

I would try that but my winders are 4 metres above the floor
It may be possible to send a raw ZWave command, as the Fakro is identified in that menu item. If this is possible I would be keen to do so as the winders ARE noisy! Anything to enhance the WAF (wife acceptance factor) would be appreciated

hmmm. fortunately I can access mine!

Excluded and tried to re-included encrypted - encryption not supported

Supposedly the default is setting is speed 2, but the quietest setting is 1...so this is probably not going to be an earth-shattering improvement. still would be nice to try! I guess its not inconceivable my firmware is old...but the FAKROs are really targeted at a closed ecosystem (sensors, button pads) so it wouldn't be that surprising if their zwave implementation is a bit rough on the interoperability front.

Is there a way to attempt to force a config command? (e.g. raw zwave?),

Trying to think, if I did the config on my old Vera, I assume this would be 'factory reset' when I re-include in indigo?

Jumping back to this thread after an attempt to divert another discussion about challenges with motor control zwave devices [https://forums.indigodomo.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&t=22058&p=194119#p194119]

I've looked through the various discussions on this device and retested these, I think there are currently 4 limitations in Indigo support for the Fakro openers:

1. No stop command. The raw z-wave workaround described above does work. I gather Indigo doesn't have a 'native' device that includes 'stop' in its UI, which is a pity.
2. The 'dimmer' slider in the UI does nothing. So the only way of partly opening/closing is with delayed actions - partly successful as a workaround but prone to getting out of sync, and not sufficiently granular.
3. The 'on/off' status does not reliably indicate the open/closed status of the window - for instance the UI seems to report 'off' as status if that was the last command - but a status request will change that to 'on'.
4. Parameter changes aren't possible (to adjust speed).

I migrated a couple of these openers from Vera a number of years ago and my recollection was that all expected functionality was supported.

[matt (support)]

My guess, after looking over the Fakro page and manual for the ZWP10, is that the Fakro motor controller module itself only supports those 3 commands: open, close, and stop. But I'm not positive that is correct. Which specific Fakro motor controller do you have so we can try to find more technical details on it? Also re-sync it in Indigo (in the device dialog) then copy/paste the Event Log results into a reply for us. That will help us determine exactly what commands the module claims to support.

My guess, after looking over the Fakro page and manual for the ZWP10, is that the Fakro motor controller module itself only supports those 3 commands: open, close, and stop. But I'm not positive that is correct.

I'm sceptical this is the case because- as I mentioned above - I'm pretty sure i used to see the full functionality I summarised with these on a Vera device, thats why I haven't assumed this is an inherent device limitation. That was a few years ago [but the same
Fakro devices I still have], so as a sanity check I have Googled around other HA forums I can see references to the devices working properly (and accepting parameter changes). Below I've attached a contemporary screen shot from the AU supplier of these devices in this user-guide: https://www.digitalhomesystems.com.au/documentation/VeraGatewaysUI7installationManual.pdf,

Screen Shot 2020-07-31 at 7.50.13 am.png (215.36 KiB) Viewed 3714 times

The user guide goes on to describe a scene in which the window is triggered to 'open to 75'.

Screen Shot 2020-07-31 at 7.38.20 am.png (132.84 KiB) Viewed 3714 times

Which specific Fakro motor controller do you have so we can try to find more technical details on it? Also re-sync it in Indigo (in the device dialog) then copy/paste the Event Log results into a reply for us. That will help us determine exactly what commands the module claims to support.

Sure. I actually run 5 of these, all "ZWS12n AUS chain actuator user
manual (Motor Class C)" end-user documentation here: https://www.digitalhomesystems.com.au/documentation/Fakro_ZWave_ZWS12_WChain_Winder_Manual.pdf

I don't have a ZP10 (or any other Fakro remote)..but .that looks like their most basic remote with just up, stop, down buttons, so might not address the percentage open commands?

Here's the log entry on sync:

Code: Select all

Z-Wave                          Syncing - started for "upstairs upper window"
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - retrieved module neighbors list: 14, 16, 17, 20, 22, 24, 25, 27, 28, 30, 31, 36
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - assigning return route to "029 - upstairs upper window"
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - assigned return route
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - retrieved manufacture and model names: Fakro - 0085, Motor Control Class C - 00030001
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - retrieved protocol version 3.42, app version 4.13
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - retrieved class hierarchy: Routing Slave : Mulitlevel Switch : Motor Control Class C (04 : 11 : 07, base 26)
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - retrieved command classes: 20v1 85v1 26v3 27v1 72v1 73v1 75v1 98v1 86v1 25v1
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - retrieved encrypt commands: - none -
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - retrieved capabilities: routing, beaming, security
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - retrieved group 1 associations: [1]
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - group 1 association to interface already exists (skipping)
   Z-Wave                          Syncing - complete

I gather from discussions above that the device possibly isn't declaring its parameter-setting capability correctly - if this is so it looks like someother controller implementations apparently must have a work-around for this and any other apparent limitations.

Let me know if anything else required.

Hi!

I have had 4 Fakro winders in service for a few years now (see my earlier posts). I have them defined as Zwave Motor Control Class C devices, and use the on-off controls, with ZWave command for stop in Action groups on the relevant control page. I have no requirement for opening to a specified percentage, but just checked and confirmed that set to specified percentage in the UI seems to work. The UI “brightness” slider also reports (albeit unreliable!) the percentage open that I also display on the control page. Have you enabled polling on each of the winder devices? Mine is enabled to poll only when activity is detected.

Are you also aware that the position reporting requires calibration? Due to the window design, I have had to shorten the chains, and omitted to do this at installation! The motors are now 4 metres above floor level, so I’m accepting that my windows only open to about 40% until such time as I need t access the windows for other reasons!!

As you state, the ability to set parameters using the Interfaces>ZWave menu is not possible - the Fakro devices do not appear in the device selection drop-down. The ability to set speed would be desirable as they are VERY noisy devices. As this needs to be done only occasionally (in my use case), a raw ZWave command would suffice.


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Very interesting! ... I had lost track that there was a manually forced calibration process required to enable the percent-open features (re-reading the manuals I see this is separate to the automatic process by which it finds the extreme limits after inclusion). I would have lost the original calibration when including the devices in Indigo - I really don't recall whether this was done again.

But I've had a quick go at forcing calibration using the button press sequence but no joy so far..does this mean its already calibrated?? ... I'll try again over the weekend. I see Parameter 7 gives calibration status (setting to 1 should force the calibration process, and set itself to 2 once calibrated...) but of course parameter settings are not currently accessible in Indigo.

Due to Corona lockdown I can't readily visit the other site where I have these installed - that was a 'clean' Indigo install ... I have a niggling idea the 'brightness' bar might be behaving differently there (though still not reliably, thats where I've had to implement the timed opening approach - though I gather you say the Indigo slider and the actual values don't necessarily align...this might have confused things so I might need to revisit). I do have one still boxed device so will also have a fiddle with that over the weekend.

Hi everyone.

Just some raw zwave commands for you to play with, at your own risk.

All blinds/window openers/etc will typically use the Switch_MultiLevel command class which allows for "Close fully", "Open fully", "Start opening", "Start closing", "Stop" and "Go to position".

Set parameter 7 - speed
0x70 0x03 0x07 0x01 0x0# where # is 1-4 based on speed

Go to position
0x26 0x01 #### where #### is between 0x01 (position level 1) and 0x63 (position level 99)

Go to last open position (as opposed to full open)
0x26 0x01 0xFF

Request current position (result returned by zwave debug or zwave watcher plugin
0x26 0x02

Peter

oh wow, those are. showing signs of working!



can I sanity check, in the string returned on the current position request, it's the last octet I'm looking for?, eg the 36 below?

Code: Select all

Raw command received (Node 28): 01 09 00 04 00 1C 03 26 03 FE 36

Any chance you would be able to conjure up the string to read the calibration. parameter (Parameter 12) - or to set to 1 (force re-calibration)?