Finally - Seamless Wireless Roaming/Handoff

Hi all,

I've recently moved to Oman and am awaiting my container to arrive full of my HA goodies. I have moved into a huge house that fortunately has CAT5 wiring to most rooms, so I bought a couple of Asus AC routers with Merlins firmware installed, mainly to help with a permanent UK VPN. I have a local ISP router in bridge mode in the middle of the downstairs area feeding the first router and then that one feeding via Cat5 to the second Asus upstairs. I use the same channel and SSD but as others have said, the devices hang on for grim death to the weak signal and I have quite a few dead areas.

So my questions are really this -

1. Can I still use the first router as a wifi and router and AP's elsewhere, or do I need to disable the wifi and have an AP there as well as elsewhere?
2. Do they need to talk to each other wirelessly of can I make use of the cat 5?
3. Karl would you mind posting the process of how you set them up, no doubt it'd save a lot of messing about.

Thank you!

Gareth

Hi all,

I've recently moved to Oman and am awaiting my container to arrive full of my HA goodies. I have moved into a huge house that fortunately has CAT5 wiring to most rooms, so I bought a couple of Asus AC routers with Merlins firmware installed, mainly to help with a permanent UK VPN. I have a local ISP router in bridge mode in the middle of the downstairs area feeding the first router and then that one feeding via Cat5 to the second Asus upstairs. I use the same channel and SSD but as others have said, the devices hang on for grim death to the weak signal and I have quite a few dead areas.

So my questions are really this -

1. Can I still use the first router as a wifi and router and AP's elsewhere, or do I need to disable the wifi and have an AP there as well as elsewhere?
2. Do they need to talk to each other wirelessly of can I make use of the cat 5?
3. Karl would you mind posting the process of how you set them up, no doubt it'd save a lot of messing about.

Yes - set up the first router to function as a router and run DNS and DHCP. You should be able to leave Wifi on that router. Set all of the remaining APs to "bridge mode" and connect them to the router by CAT 5. Ideally, you want them on DIFFERENT channels. If you don't, they will create interference with each other and overall slow down communications. Use channels 1, 6 & 11 on 2.4Ghz and 36 or 149 on 5Ghz. If the AP supports DFS, you can also use channels 100, 116 & 132. There may be a couple of other channels available to you depending on what market your APs were designed for.

Probably the most important thing as it relates to this thread is to have APs that support 802.11 r/k/v - if your APs support these standards, handoffs between APs will be extremely rapid. Other than the Apple AirPort Extreme, I don't know which other APs support this. I know the Ubiquiti Unifi series do not, but is planned in a future update.

Perfect response.
Some remarks.
Asus does not support any hand off. It will take some time to switch from one ap to the next. Switch wifi off/on does the trick.

The unifi actually do a seamless handoff on 2 and 5 ghz. They have their on method to do it. But not all models do it. Only the ap-pro do it
I can walk through my house and on both frequencies it works fine while on the phone making a wifi call.

Karl




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Thanks both. Ok I decided not to compromise on this so bought 3 x ap-pro,s and will probably turn asus wifi off, as that is still just about available upstairs so I'm guessing that if I leave it on then I'd have little improvement over how it is now.

I did consider the ap-lr but I kept reading about small differences with the pro the may be more important in future so went that way, now I just need to be patient and wait a week or two for them to arrive!

Thanks both. Ok I decided not to compromise on this so bought 3 x ap-pro,s and will probably turn asus wifi off, as that is still just about available upstairs so I'm guessing that if I leave it on then I'd have little improvement over how it is now.

I did consider the ap-lr but I kept reading about small differences with the pro the may be more important in future so went that way, now I just need to be patient and wait a week or two for them to arrive!

The Unifi system is addictive. I predict you'll shortly order the Unifi Security Gateway & Unifi Cloudkey. In fact, you might as well order them now.

The lr does not support the hand off. ONLY the ap-pro does!!!


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also:
I have 3 AP-pro and for 2,4 GHz it is actually to much for my house.

here my setup

front of home : 2.4GHZ=channel 11 for some special devices (2 cameras), 5Ghz channel 36, participate in 0handoff
middle of home : 2.4GHZ=channel 1 participate in 0handoff , 5Ghz channel 36, participate in 0handoff
back of home : 2.4GHZ=channel 1 fparticipate in 0handoff , 5Ghz channel 36, participate in 0handoff

Karl

The lr does not support the hand off. ONLY the ap-pro does!!!

What handoff are you describing?
As we discussed earlier in this thread, Ubiquity says ZH is only available on the older (square) APs.

Re: Zero Handoff: Support for UAP-AC-PRO?
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‎02-18-2016 09:41 AM

@esseph is right. Currently there are no plans for ZHO on gen2 AC products. The focus will be 802.11r/v/k.

Cheers,
Mike

https://community.ubnt.com/t5/UniFi-Wir ... 351#M23046

Re: Zero Handoff: Support for UAP-AC-PRO? [ Edited ]
Options
‎02-18-2016 03:11 PM - edited ‎02-18-2016 03:13 PM

@Solar_Ize

So this is a common misconception. ZHO is not needed to have a common SSID across multiple access points.

Are you aware that normal roaming is supported on all models?

ZHO/ZHR is typically only needed for devices that need extremely low latency roaming (i.e. picky VoIP phones that will often be roaming between access points), and is recommended for those scenarios as ZHO/ZHR requires single-channel architecture, which of course has performance implications (see more on that below).

Most/all modern devices handle roaming fine. Around 2012 and prior, some devices did poorly with roaming, so ZHO was a way to 'trick' these clients into roaming effectively. Unless using really old, or really sensitive gear, it is unnecessary.

Some examples of equipment that may want ZHO:
Old 802.11g barcode scanners that need to roam across many APs (i.e. will be traversing campuses) while active.
Old WiFi VoIP phones that need to hold VoIP calls while roaming across multiple APs.
The 'downside' of ZHO (and why it shouldn't be used on 11AC networks) is that it is a single-channel architecture. So it effectively eliminates 11AC rates/speeds and also should only be used in not-dense networks (so it shouldn't be used for 11AC devices).

I hope that helps.

Cheers,
Brandon

https://community.ubnt.com/t5/UniFi-Wir ... 723#M23056

yes you are right its not perfect, but it works

my charter internet gives me 60mbit down and I get that on my iPhone on 2.4GHZ and 5 GHZ channel with said setup and I don't have holes in coverage AND the handover between the APs on my iPhone is without any hick-up = no dropped call no break in connection, can continue to talk and listen ..

Karl

Hi all,

I have a flat which is 80sq, plus garden/parking and so on it is almost 100sq.
Unfortunately the WiFi router (Fritz!Box 7490) is located and one side of the flat (where the phone plug is located) and I couldn't reach the other side of the garden+parking so I bought a Fritz!Repeater (E310) which works fine for maybe two weeks then something happens; I still have connection to the repeater and the repeater does have connection to router but something is not OK because, for example, Skype videocall are so bad, webpages loading is slow and so on.
I need to have time to sit there and make an analisys of what is going on.
The other idea is to buy an access point (maybe Ubiquiti, that's why I am posting here ), connect it via ethernet cable (I have Ethernet cable running in my flat) and place it in the middle of the flat and then disable the WiFi of the Fritz!Box (or keep it both active if needed).

What is wrong with my idea?

Thanks
Marco

On amazon.de there are a lot of Unifi-UAP-LR but only one sold and shipped by Amazon (I would prefer this option in case of problems and so on).
Namely:

https://www.amazon.de/Ubiquiti-UAP-LR-N ... s=UniFi+lr

From other resellers it is a little bit expensive, but this one has no review.

Is it exactly the LR version?
I have problems of WiFi range in my flat/terrace/garden.

And why in the name there is no AC? In the "Amazon questions" someone asked if this model has AC and someone answered no, model with AC is another one, but from the Ubiquiti page it seems there is only one UAP-LR model, or am I wrong?

The final configuration would be:

UAP-LR --> SWITCH --> FritzBox (connected to internet).
Will it work with the switch (Netgear or TP-Link I do not remember exactly which I have at that location) or shall it be directly connected to router?

Will it work with the switch (Netgear or TP-Link I do not remember exactly which I have at that location) or shall it be directly connected to router?

The AP should work with the switch just fine, however, I have mine plugged directly into my router--I have a POE router and this keeps me from having to use an injector.

I didn't opt for an LR. My house is two story and has an approximately 30 x 60 footprint and I opted for the AC-Lite. I placed it on a wall in roughly the center of the footprint on the first floor (in a basement stairwell) and I get good coverage throughout the house. Outdoor isn't that great but I blame that on exterior walls covered in cement siding. I don't use wifi much outside, so I've never bothered to add an outdoor AP.

My ISP is driving 50 Mps and I'm getting 145 Mps internally.

Hi Dave,

many thanks for the answer
The problem is that router is located in a storage room at one side of the flat and the garden/parking zone where I need wifi in at the opposite side from there.
I think that the AC-Lite would be enough, but now I am not able to decide between AC-LR and AC-Pro

The Ethernet cable solution should work. If you use the ap you also have to have a controller ( software on mac raspberry pi pic or a controller device from ubiquiti. )
And see the hand off discussion



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Hi Dave,

many thanks for the answer
The problem is that router is located in a storage room at one side of the flat and the garden/parking zone where I need wifi in at the opposite side from there.
I think that the AC-Lite would be enough, but now I am not able to decide between AC-LR and AC-Pro

Given the small price difference, I would get the UAC-AP-PRO. Why?

- PRO uses 802.11af PoE, which makes it easier to find compatible PoE switches.
- It's faster on both 2.5 and 5 Ghz bands.
- It's the flagship and all of Ubiquiti's regular software upgrades are optimized for the PRO. This includes 802.11 r/k/v, which is the point of this thread.